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West Midlands Trains: 10 December 2017 - April 2026
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Divington_R



Joined: 05 Feb 2016
Posts: 246
Location: Nuneaton

PostPosted: Sat Sep 16, 2017 9:03 pm    Post subject: West Midlands Trains: 10 December 2017 - April 2026 Reply with quote

Using my recently acquired and improving internet skills (!) I have tried to do some research about the new train company taking over from London Midland on December 10th 2017.

There is a useful set of slides on the Stourbridge User Group pages. The slides can be found on this web site link.

Web admin note: link removed as per http://forum.svra.org.uk/viewtopic.php?t=3959
PJ September 2017

To share my findings a new forum title has been created so I hope this will be OK?

From what I have found about ‘WMTrains’ intent within the SVR area I raise two points:

1. It appears that an extra 100 car parking spaces will be created at Kidderminster, yet no date is mentioned. How this could work at the current Kidderminster car park is not clear to me.

2. The running through to the Safari Park (by December 2019!) is subject to a station being built. I have read this as though someone else will build the station and not West Midlands Trains. The timescale to build the station and by whom seems quite a short timescale?
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hearn_p



Joined: 15 Nov 2003
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The link takes me to a Facebook log in page I'm afraid and I can't see it on the SLUG Facebook page so I can't comment on the points you raise.

The West Midlands Combined Authority's 2026 Delivery Plan for Transport mentions Kidderminstrer once - "TABLE 2 BROAD LOCATIONS FOR NEW STRATEGIC PARK AND RIDE" - and SVR not at all. https://www.tfwm.org.uk/media/2524/2026-delivery-for-transport-final.pdf

There is already a thread for Safari Park link to the SVR at http://forum.svra.org.uk/viewtopic.php?t=3954

The WMCA's "West Midlands Rail Franchise Award" report https://governance.wmca.org.uk/documents/s603/TDC%20Franchise%20Award%20Report%204%20September%202017%20Final%20v2.pdf says:

2.9 WMT will also be actively developing proposals for a number of new services
within the WMR area including:
 New service to West Midlands Safari Park as an extension of Birmingham
- Kidderminster services which will operate along the Severn Valley
Railway

2.10 The delivery of these new services have not been explicitly contracted within the
new franchise and are subject to feasibility studies being undertaken and support
from WMCA/TfWM as required.

3.4 promises increased frequencies for Kidderminster from 2018 and 2021

Patrick
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Standard Tank



Joined: 20 Sep 2009
Posts: 182
Location: Kidderminster

PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reg and Patrick

I have altered how the information is presented on the SLUG fb site so the link will not work but the appropriate text is still provided.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/407285492711907/
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Bob Randle
http://www.stourbridgelineusergroup.info/ https://www.facebook.com/groups/407285492711907/
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Divington_R



Joined: 05 Feb 2016
Posts: 246
Location: Nuneaton

PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Patrick and Bob,

The internet link identified in my first statement still seems works for me so I am a bit puzzled why you cannot reach it? It concerns a set of presentation slides on the dubject of 'West Midlands Trains, an introduction to our franchise'. Dated August 14th 2017. My computer knowlegde is not at expert level so not sure how else I csn direct you.
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45002



Joined: 14 Jul 2006
Posts: 524
Location: Area 51.............

PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:49 pm    Post subject: WARNING, WARNING, WARNING, WARNING...... Reply with quote

I would advise Everyone Not to click on the links in the 1st post, as when I did I received a Email with a code to reset my facebook password Evil or Very Mad

I did however change my FB password via the normal method just as a precaution Wink

MARTIN Rolling Eyes
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Standard Tank



Joined: 20 Sep 2009
Posts: 182
Location: Kidderminster

PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 6:59 pm    Post subject: Re: WARNING, WARNING, WARNING, WARNING...... Reply with quote

45002 wrote:
I would advise Everyone Not to click on the links in the 1st post, as when I did I received a Email with a code to reset my facebook password Evil or Very Mad

I did however change my FB password via the normal method just as a precaution Wink

MARTIN Rolling Eyes


I agree, can the admin delete the thread lease
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jackson_p



Joined: 02 Jul 2003
Posts: 513
Location: The Midlands, England

PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Web admin note: Link now removed as requested
PJ September 2017
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Paul J.
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Standard Tank



Joined: 20 Sep 2009
Posts: 182
Location: Kidderminster

PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The removed link in the opening post contained the following text:-

This is what Abellio are telling Stakeholders, Subject to the usual caveats.
Train services
December 2018
• Major timetable recast, based on improving the performance of Birmingham New Street− currently the highest cause of secondary delay to train services in the whole of the UK
• We will do this by reducing turnround services by up to 50%, freeing up platforms to allow any later running trains to make up time
• This will help all Train Operators including Cross Country and West Coast services.
We will also:
• reduce journey times between Euston and Birmingham and Euston and Crewe
• run new through services between London and Birmingham International to Liverpool and Walsall and between Nuneaton, Coventry and Leamington Spa
• introduce additional services between Shrewsbury and Birmingham and Wolverhampton and Crewe
• provide a new hourly Sunday service between Shrewsbury and Birmingham
• run additional earlier and later services to Hereford, Crewe, Northampton and Liverpool.
December 2019
• We will double the services between Nuneaton and Coventry SX and SU via the Ricoh Stadium after completion of the new bay platform at Coventry. We will replace the single car train with 2 car Class 172 trains. On Saturdays we will run 3 trains per hour
• There are plans to build 7 new stations in the West Midlands, subject to the successful completion of feasibility studies
• Stourbridge Junction terminators will reverse and we have an aspiration to run them to a new station at Brierley Hill, converting the existing double freight lines to two single lines, one passenger and one freight
• We plan to extend Kidderminster terminators onto the Severn Valley Railway, subject to a new station being built at the West Midlands Safari Park.
May 2021
• A new Sunday timetable that runs as many services as Saturdays, doubling the current number ofservices. A new Sunday service will run between Bedford and Bletchley.
December 2023
• We have an aspiration to extend Brierley Hill services to interchange with the new Midland Metro station we have planned for at Canal St.
Fleet
December 2018
•172/0 introduced from GOB 8x2car
•230/2 introduced Bedford-Bletchley 3x2car.
December 2019
•350/4 introduced from TPE 10x4car.
December 2020
•All 15X and 170 removed
•New DMUs introduced, 12x2car and 14x4car.
May 2021
•350/2 removed
•New EMUs introduced, 42x5car and 36x3car.
Station car parks
Number of additional car parking spaces
WCSBU
Bletchley 100
Hemel Hempstead 100
Leighton Buzzard 100
Milton Keynes Central 130
Northampton 110
Nuneaton 70
Tamworth 30
Watford Junction 100
WMSBU
Kidderminster 100
Stone 100
Telford 100
Worcester SH 10
Total 1050
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GWR5764PT



Joined: 11 Sep 2006
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Location: Kidderminster Station

PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice to see the SVR is the forefront of all of this not, I am a cynic I don't believe this will happen. If the franchise wants it the line speed would have to be upgraded, so why not upgrade the whole line to 50 mph as part of the deal.
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Graham



Joined: 21 May 2011
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Location: The banks of the River Severn as it meanders through the sun dappled leafy glades of Worcestershire

PostPosted: Sun Sep 17, 2017 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's about 2 miles from Kidderminster to the safari park.
At a constant 25mph, it would take about 2 minutes 30 seconds.
At a constant 50mph it would take about 1 minute 15 seconds. that's before you allow for longer acceleration and braking distances and any speed restrictions on Falling Sands Viaduct, so probably less than a minute gained overall.
I think the key phrases are "...subject to a new station being built at the West Midlands Safari Park" and "...subject to the successful completion of feasibility studies".
At the moment, it looks good on paper, because WMT look like they're trying to improve and expand their service, and WMSP look like they're trying to include green travel in their plans to build on the Green Belt.
I wonder how much of a foregone conclusion the feasibility study is?
Does anyone know of any other non-railway related tourist attraction that has its own dedicated railway station?
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Graham Phillips
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Danny252



Joined: 01 Oct 2009
Posts: 1192

PostPosted: Mon Sep 18, 2017 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Graham wrote:
That's before you allow for longer acceleration and braking distances and any speed restrictions on Falling Sands Viaduct, so probably less than a minute gained overall.


Even without line speed upgrades, the higher acceleration of a modern DMU would reduce journey times. Even the SVR's first generation DMU is noticeably speedier from section to section than loco-hauled sets.
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sharpo



Joined: 19 Feb 2006
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Location: Dark Side

PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Graham wrote:
It's about 2 miles from Kidderminster to the safari park.
At a constant 25mph, it would take about 2 minutes 30 seconds.
At a constant 50mph it would take about 1 minute 15 seconds. that's before you allow for longer acceleration and braking distances and any speed restrictions on Falling Sands Viaduct, so probably less than a minute gained overall.


Those timings are incorrect.

Without going into precise minutes and seconds, and playing with round figures - 2 miles is about 1/12th of 25, so it will take about 5 minutes to cover that distance. At 50mph it would be about 2½ minutes.

Watching a video of a unit from main line station to goods loop, the time is about 2 minutes, so that would probably mean a similar time to run onto the SVR via the exchange siding. I reckon 8 minutes for that distance start to stop at 25mph max, or a couple of minutes less at 50mph max.
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Graham



Joined: 21 May 2011
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Location: The banks of the River Severn as it meanders through the sun dappled leafy glades of Worcestershire

PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My mistake, I calculated the times per mile without allowing for it being a two mile journey. If you double my times, they agree with yours.
8 minutes sounds realistic, start to stop, but then it's got to come back again, which means a 16 minute interruption to SVR trains, plus time to set down and pick up passengers, so closer to 20 minutes really. This all depends on whether there's a loop or spur at the safari park that would allow an SVR train to pass the WMT train.
It also means that any delay on the SVR that caused a train to be held at Kidderminster main line station could have a knock on effect on other NR trains.
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sharpo



Joined: 19 Feb 2006
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Location: Dark Side

PostPosted: Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about - at Kidder a train off NR could be held in the "loop" (I don't know terminology for the two tracks alongside the carriage shed!) until an SVR train from Bewdley arrived, or if it had to follow another train heading to Bewdley. That would avoid NR blockage.
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threelinkdave



Joined: 22 Dec 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sharpo wrote:
How about - at Kidder a train off NR could be held in the "loop" (I don't know terminology for the two tracks alongside the carriage shed!) until an SVR train from Bewdley arrived, or if it had to follow another train heading to Bewdley. That would avoid NR blockage.
The NR connection leads to the main. The line nearer the shed is the loop. A train from NR could be held in the main and both platforms are accessible from the loop
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